EF vs EF

[Bearhugger]

The Cameron Tournament had a very good collection of teams. We had East Fairmont vs East Fairmont in the finals at 106.

Once again, East Fairmont has TWO 106 pounders that could, should and would qualify for the state tournament and make it onto the podium.

[dunbar76]

Way to go EF!!!

[Treerat]

I see where 2 JV wrestlers from Point Pleasant won 1st and 2nd in the 106 lb class at the Pat Vance Invitational this weekend

[vortexfan]

I hear this but just wait for the comments not everyone can get a trophy and life’s not fair. (Everyone gets a trophy sayers)
Terrible if your a talented kid that would place and beat other kids from other schools but the powers to be just can’t come up with a way to let them (JVs) compete in the states.
I’m still for team dual championships (to determine team champion in duals) and open individual champions to allow all wrestlers to participate.

[Oldtimer]

I would say that both East Fairmont and Point Pleasant both have two kids at least that would place at states at 106.

[Oldtimer]

I would say both East Fairmont and Point Pleasant would place at least two wrestlers each at 106. I like the State Duals idea.

[Bearhugger]

I hear this but just wait for the comments not everyone can get a trophy and life’s not fair. (Everyone gets a trophy sayers)
Terrible if your a talented kid that would place and beat other kids from other schools but the powers to be just can’t come up with a way to let them (JVs) compete in the states.
I’m still for team dual championships (to determine team champion in duals) and open individual champions to allow all wrestlers to participate.

While I was at the National Guard Duals hearing about the "Fayette County Screw Job" that three schools got, I heard an incredible idea from a genius.

I will share it in another forum topic in less than 24 hours. Look for "Last Man Standing".

GREAT IDEA! This will blow some of the old school crowd's minds.

[Matman31]

Both EF kids are studs, both are big 106

[Bearhugger]

I hear this but just wait for the comments not everyone can get a trophy and life’s not fair. (Everyone gets a trophy sayers)
Terrible if your a talented kid that would place and beat other kids from other schools but the powers to be just can’t come up with a way to let them (JVs) compete in the states.
I’m still for team dual championships (to determine team champion in duals) and open individual champions to allow all wrestlers to participate.

EF's JV wrestler got a trophy alright. He got second place because he entered the tournament and went THROUGH everybody in his way to the finals. I call that competing and earning what you got.

[vortexfan]

I hear this but just wait for the comments not everyone can get a trophy and life’s not fair. (Everyone gets a trophy sayers)
Terrible if your a talented kid that would place and beat other kids from other schools but the powers to be just can’t come up with a way to let them (JVs) compete in the states.
I’m still for team dual championships (to determine team champion in duals) and open individual champions to allow all wrestlers to participate.

EF's JV wrestler got a trophy alright. He got second place because he entered the tournament and went THROUGH everybody in his way to the finals. I call that competing and earning what you got.

EXCELLENT! Let’s make wrestling great again!

[mike.carman]

I hear this but just wait for the comments not everyone can get a trophy and life’s not fair. (Everyone gets a trophy sayers)
Terrible if your a talented kid that would place and beat other kids from other schools but the powers to be just can’t come up with a way to let them (JVs) compete in the states.
I’m still for team dual championships (to determine team champion in duals) and open individual champions to allow all wrestlers to participate.

EF's JV wrestler got a trophy alright. He got second place because he entered the tournament and went THROUGH everybody in his way to the finals. I call that competing and earning what you got.

EXCELLENT! Let’s make wrestling great again!

It's not about "everyone gets a trophy". It's about how many kids are allowed to represent their school. You can only have 1 representative per school per weight class at the state tournament. Likewise, you can only have 1 representative per school per weight class at the regional. It's that simple. That would be like having 2 varsity football teams or 2 varsity basketball teams, it's ridiculous. It's great that there are tournaments out there that allow JVs to participate and get mat time against quality competition and if a JV kid can place, even better. It just simply does not belong at regionals or states especially since each kid is trying to earn team points for their respective school.

Just because someone is good, doesn't mean they are ENTITLED to a starting roll if someone else is better. You have to crack the lineup by beating the number 1 guy in your weight class. That in itself is the fairest method in sports today. There is no subjectivity involved. If you can't, you sit and for me personally, that is why I love this sport. If you remove the competition from the individual rooms and make it so everyone gets to compete, you will weaken the sport and the programs in the long run. Kids will have no reason to work hard and get better and will simply accept playing second fiddle because they will still be allowed to compete anyway.

Get better, get bigger, get smaller.
JMO

[Gator]

I admire the kids who wrestle JV and keep working for a starting position. South has a 4th place finisher at the state tournament last year wrestling JV and occasionally starting in Ian Irizarry. Ian and Tucker Windland have been neck and neck in wrestle offs, but Ian has stuck it out.

I think kids like Ian are some of the most valuable on the team. He keeps on grinding and will have his day soon.

[george]

Not sure how I feel about multiple entries in one weight class. Some states do it, most do not.

But to play devil's advocate. Individual sports are different from team sports.

Tennis teams seed the kids on their own team. Then separate the regional/state tournaments by seed, but not every state does that.
In track, if the two best kids in the 100 meter dash go to the same school, they both can be state medalists.
In swimming, if the two best kids in the 50 meter free go to the same school, they can both be state medalists.
In cross country, multiple kids from one school can enter an event and only after the event is finished are the scoring runners determined. Fairly sure you can medal individually without scoring for your team if multiple kids place higher from your team.
Pretty sure golf has a similar set up although I admit I'm not as familiar with the sport.
Wrestling, be the best kid in your weight class at your school. OR sit on the bench OR gain or lose weight in an attempt to beat someone else from your team.

Not sure there is an ideal solution, but I'm positive allowing more than one wrestler at a weight helps kids get better during in-season events.

[mike.carman]

Not sure how I feel about multiple entries in one weight class. Some states do it, most do not.

But to play devil's advocate. Individual sports are different from team sports.

Tennis teams seed the kids on their own team. Then separate the regional/state tournaments by seed, but not every state does that.
In track, if the two best kids in the 100 meter dash go to the same school, they both can be state medalists.
In swimming, if the two best kids in the 50 meter free go to the same school, they can both be state medalists.
In cross country, multiple kids from one school can enter an event and only after the event is finished are the scoring runners determined. Fairly sure you can medal individually without scoring for your team if multiple kids place higher from your team.
Pretty sure golf has a similar set up although I admit I'm not as familiar with the sport.
Wrestling, be the best kid in your weight class at your school. OR sit on the bench OR gain or lose weight in an attempt to beat someone else from your team.

Not sure there is an ideal solution, but I'm positive allowing more than one wrestler at a weight helps kids get better during in-season events.

This is the most compelling argument I have heard yet. However, Wrestling is in itself so different from even the other individual sports. It embodies so many intangibles that it is impossible to mention all of them. I don't want to down play any other sport as they all take a tremendous amount of work to excel at but wrestling is different. No other sport requires as much dedication to physical fitness, mental fortitude and perseverance than wrestling and to allow multiple kids from the same school to compete for a State title is wrong in my opinion. That doesn't mean that the JV kids aren't good, they are and there are a lot that are very good and there are some that are very good in very competitive weight classes, they just simple aren't the best on the team at their weight. And in these isolated instances they aren't the best on their team up a weight or down a weight if there is a weight class below. When my son was a Freshman, we had a Junior who was a state placer the year before at 113 and 120. Anthony could not make 106 and could not beat the 113 in wrestle offs, however he could beat the 120. He put on weight and wrestled 120 all year and placed 4th. If he Had he not been able to win the 120 spot, he would have wrestled JV all year and the wrestle offs were close matches both at 113 and 120. However, we had a state placer wrestling JV for his Junior year because there was no where for the 120 to go. He lost his wrestle off for 126 too. I have no doubt that he would have placed again if in the lineup. Last year we had several kids who could have done well at their weights but couldn't win the weight class. Some were able to wrestle up and some are starters this year. This is not a new occurrence.

Something I would be in favor of is this:
Have a regional JV Tournament and allow the finalist to be placed in the regional bracket against the 1 and 2 seeded kids the first round(splitting team mates of course and only 1 JV kid per weight class per team). If they place top 4 then they can go to states.

With that said, with numbers being what they are and teams struggling to field a complete lineup, I don't think a JV Regional Championship would have any worth and in a lot of cases you might have 1 or 2 kids which would default to the Varsity Regional, so at this time I don't see that as a viable solution in reality either.

[Bearhugger]

EF's JV wrestler got a trophy alright. He got second place because he entered the tournament and went THROUGH everybody in his way to the finals. I call that competing and earning what you got.

EXCELLENT! Let’s make wrestling great again!

It's not about "everyone gets a trophy". It's about how many kids are allowed to represent their school. You can only have 1 representative per school per weight class at the state tournament. Likewise, you can only have 1 representative per school per weight class at the regional. It's that simple. That would be like having 2 varsity football teams or 2 varsity basketball teams, it's ridiculous. It's great that there are tournaments out there that allow JVs to participate and get mat time against quality competition and if a JV kid can place, even better. It just simply does not belong at regionals or states especially since each kid is trying to earn team points for their respective school.

Just because someone is good, doesn't mean they are ENTITLED to a starting roll if someone else is better. You have to crack the lineup by beating the number 1 guy in your weight class. That in itself is the fairest method in sports today. There is no subjectivity involved. If you can't, you sit and for me personally, that is why I love this sport. If you remove the competition from the individual rooms and make it so everyone gets to compete, you will weaken the sport and the programs in the long run. Kids will have no reason to work hard and get better and will simply accept playing second fiddle because they will still be allowed to compete anyway.

Get better, get bigger, get smaller.
JMO

1. Easy fix. The JV wrestlers' team points DO NOT COUNT.
2. I am convinced that the more the JV kids get to wrestle, the more participation the sport will have. Some say we are not teaching hard work by letting them all wrestle. I say we are NOT teaching hard work when we shut down schools because it is cold. 99% of the JV are going to get their butts kicked in the region anyway.
3. We all watch all season long and see the 1 to 3 JV kids wrestle and defeat many, many other varsity wrestlers. Then at the end of the season, we see these "varsity" wrestlers on the podium. Yes, they earned their spot on the podium by wrestling the competition they face. On the other hand, some of them are lucky that the JV kid who beat them 1 to 3 times during the season is not allowed to compete. If he was, they would be in the stands and not on the podium.

[Bearhugger]

Not sure how I feel about multiple entries in one weight class. Some states do it, most do not.

But to play devil's advocate. Individual sports are different from team sports.

Tennis teams seed the kids on their own team. Then separate the regional/state tournaments by seed, but not every state does that.
In track, if the two best kids in the 100 meter dash go to the same school, they both can be state medalists.
In swimming, if the two best kids in the 50 meter free go to the same school, they can both be state medalists.
In cross country, multiple kids from one school can enter an event and only after the event is finished are the scoring runners determined. Fairly sure you can medal individually without scoring for your team if multiple kids place higher from your team.
Pretty sure golf has a similar set up although I admit I'm not as familiar with the sport.
Wrestling, be the best kid in your weight class at your school. OR sit on the bench OR gain or lose weight in an attempt to beat someone else from your team.

Not sure there is an ideal solution, but I'm positive allowing more than one wrestler at a weight helps kids get better during in-season events.

When we talk about these "JV Wrestlers", we are usually referring to 1 to 2, maybe 3 kids. They are back ups to wrestlers that are typically in the top three in the whole state.

Here is a good example. Sam Adams of Independence. He is a freshman wrestling 152, weighing less and not cutting. Here is who he is behind:

132: Returning state champion Hunter Taylor. 5th the season before. Senior.
138: Tanner Harris. 2x runner up and third last season. Senior.
145: Alex Hart. Injured last season. Runner up and NHSCA All American in 2016. Senior.
152: Returning state champion Haegan Harvey. 4th the season before. Senior.
160: Returning 2x state champion Connor Gibson. 6th as a freshman. Senior.

Sam has already wrestled and defeated a returning state tournament qualifier from another school.

I guess Sam hasn't worked hard enough. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA

[Bearhugger]

Not sure how I feel about multiple entries in one weight class. Some states do it, most do not.

But to play devil's advocate. Individual sports are different from team sports.

Tennis teams seed the kids on their own team. Then separate the regional/state tournaments by seed, but not every state does that.
In track, if the two best kids in the 100 meter dash go to the same school, they both can be state medalists.
In swimming, if the two best kids in the 50 meter free go to the same school, they can both be state medalists.
In cross country, multiple kids from one school can enter an event and only after the event is finished are the scoring runners determined. Fairly sure you can medal individually without scoring for your team if multiple kids place higher from your team.
Pretty sure golf has a similar set up although I admit I'm not as familiar with the sport.
Wrestling, be the best kid in your weight class at your school. OR sit on the bench OR gain or lose weight in an attempt to beat someone else from your team.

Not sure there is an ideal solution, but I'm positive allowing more than one wrestler at a weight helps kids get better during in-season events.

This is the most compelling argument I have heard yet. However, Wrestling is in itself so different from even the other individual sports. It embodies so many intangibles that it is impossible to mention all of them. I don't want to down play any other sport as they all take a tremendous amount of work to excel at but wrestling is different. No other sport requires as much dedication to physical fitness, mental fortitude and perseverance than wrestling and to allow multiple kids from the same school to compete for a State title is wrong in my opinion. That doesn't mean that the JV kids aren't good, they are and there are a lot that are very good and there are some that are very good in very competitive weight classes, they just simple aren't the best on the team at their weight. And in these isolated instances they aren't the best on their team up a weight or down a weight if there is a weight class below. When my son was a Freshman, we had a Junior who was a state placer the year before at 113 and 120. Anthony could not make 106 and could not beat the 113 in wrestle offs, however he could beat the 120. He put on weight and wrestled 120 all year and placed 4th. If he Had he not been able to win the 120 spot, he would have wrestled JV all year and the wrestle offs were close matches both at 113 and 120. However, we had a state placer wrestling JV for his Junior year because there was no where for the 120 to go. He lost his wrestle off for 126 too. I have no doubt that he would have placed again if in the lineup. Last year we had several kids who could have done well at their weights but couldn't win the weight class. Some were able to wrestle up and some are starters this year. This is not a new occurrence.

Something I would be in favor of is this:
Have a regional JV Tournament and allow the finalist to be placed in the regional bracket against the 1 and 2 seeded kids the first round(splitting team mates of course and only 1 JV kid per weight class per team). If they place top 4 then they can go to states.

With that said, with numbers being what they are and teams struggling to field a complete lineup, I don't think a JV Regional Championship would have any worth and in a lot of cases you might have 1 or 2 kids which would default to the Varsity Regional, so at this time I don't see that as a viable solution in reality either.

The regional JV tournament would create and permit TWO wrestlers in the regional tournament from the same school. I am glad you are evolving in this direction. We need to get some of the old timers and hard cases on board.

A very smart guy down in Fayette County (the county that recently got the SHAFT by their BOE) shared a great idea with me. I am going to type it up today and share. Look for "Last Man Standing". This idea will cause some folks cardiac arrest.

[coach_williams]

I have changed my thinking on this a bit and have no issue with JV wrestlers being in regionals or states.

My only stipulation would be that there is no separating them in the brackets from the varsity wrestler. If a team is going to enter a JV wrestler in the tournament then all scoring wrestlers should be at risk of elimination by that JV wrestler, not just scoring wrestlers of other teams. With risk comes reward, but there also should be an actual risk for the team entering their JV wrestler. They should not get the benefit of doubling their chances of having a qualifier/champion without the risk of having their wrestlers face each other.

My guess is most people who support JV wrestlers in regionals/states won't like this idea because they won't like the possibility of their scoring varsity wrestler getting eliminated by the non-scoring JV and hurting their teams chances of placing higher in team scoring.

Teams entering JV wrestlers should not get preferential treatment by being moved to the other side of the bracket to maximize their chances of going higher up the bracket and minimize chances of the varsity wrestler getting eliminated by the JV. If you are going to put him in there then you take the risk just like everyone else.

[george]

Bearhugger, I see you have quoted me but then go in a different direction. I never mentioned hard work or JV. Simply pointing out the way I think WV currently handles individual sports and post season qualifying although I may not be correct. I'm not sure what the ideal solution is.

If I had to pick a system, I'd probably lean toward having a team designate 14 "scoring" wrestlers for postseason regardless of weight but any number of wrestlers from each team could enter and qualify for post-season. Some just would not score for their team. I think the state of Washington or one of the Dakotas does something like this. It's probably not ideal, but is "somewhat" fair to all teams as only a set number score, but obviously teams with greater depth at some weights would benefit.

Also, this might be a good topic for a new thread.

[maskedman]

Bearhugger -

The point is a good point, but as you peel back the layer of the onion, some more, are all of those kids living in the Independence High School District, or did some transfer out of district that helped create the example that you site? Not saying anyone did anything wrong, immoral, or unethical, each county has policies for transfers, so nothing done illegal and not trying to claim that they did. I am saying that there are wrestlers at all schools that cross district lines to be part of something that they feel is right for them. Indy has a good thing going and those in the surrounding area that can be part of it, do what they can to be part of it.

What is created is a very good wrestler, wrestling JV, because there are more than one good kid there now at each weight class. It is unfortunately the nature of the beast, and rules should not be changed because of flocking, or recruiting would grow, more schools would suffer with less wrestlers available than already do.

WVSSAC allows for the out of district transfer from 8th to 9th grade. It is not wrong to do it, but when it does happen and somebody sits, that is also part of the scenario.

[mike.carman]

Not sure how I feel about multiple entries in one weight class. Some states do it, most do not.

But to play devil's advocate. Individual sports are different from team sports.

Tennis teams seed the kids on their own team. Then separate the regional/state tournaments by seed, but not every state does that.
In track, if the two best kids in the 100 meter dash go to the same school, they both can be state medalists.
In swimming, if the two best kids in the 50 meter free go to the same school, they can both be state medalists.
In cross country, multiple kids from one school can enter an event and only after the event is finished are the scoring runners determined. Fairly sure you can medal individually without scoring for your team if multiple kids place higher from your team.
Pretty sure golf has a similar set up although I admit I'm not as familiar with the sport.
Wrestling, be the best kid in your weight class at your school. OR sit on the bench OR gain or lose weight in an attempt to beat someone else from your team.

Not sure there is an ideal solution, but I'm positive allowing more than one wrestler at a weight helps kids get better during in-season events.

This is the most compelling argument I have heard yet. However, Wrestling is in itself so different from even the other individual sports. It embodies so many intangibles that it is impossible to mention all of them. I don't want to down play any other sport as they all take a tremendous amount of work to excel at but wrestling is different. No other sport requires as much dedication to physical fitness, mental fortitude and perseverance than wrestling and to allow multiple kids from the same school to compete for a State title is wrong in my opinion. That doesn't mean that the JV kids aren't good, they are and there are a lot that are very good and there are some that are very good in very competitive weight classes, they just simple aren't the best on the team at their weight. And in these isolated instances they aren't the best on their team up a weight or down a weight if there is a weight class below. When my son was a Freshman, we had a Junior who was a state placer the year before at 113 and 120. Anthony could not make 106 and could not beat the 113 in wrestle offs, however he could beat the 120. He put on weight and wrestled 120 all year and placed 4th. If he Had he not been able to win the 120 spot, he would have wrestled JV all year and the wrestle offs were close matches both at 113 and 120. However, we had a state placer wrestling JV for his Junior year because there was no where for the 120 to go. He lost his wrestle off for 126 too. I have no doubt that he would have placed again if in the lineup. Last year we had several kids who could have done well at their weights but couldn't win the weight class. Some were able to wrestle up and some are starters this year. This is not a new occurrence.

Something I would be in favor of is this:
Have a regional JV Tournament and allow the finalist to be placed in the regional bracket against the 1 and 2 seeded kids the first round(splitting team mates of course and only 1 JV kid per weight class per team). If they place top 4 then they can go to states.

With that said, with numbers being what they are and teams struggling to field a complete lineup, I don't think a JV Regional Championship would have any worth and in a lot of cases you might have 1 or 2 kids which would default to the Varsity Regional, so at this time I don't see that as a viable solution in reality either.

The regional JV tournament would create and permit TWO wrestlers in the regional tournament from the same school. I am glad you are evolving in this direction. We need to get some of the old timers and hard cases on board.

A very smart guy down in Fayette County (the county that recently got the SHAFT by their BOE) shared a great idea with me. I am going to type it up today and share. Look for "Last Man Standing". This idea will cause some folks cardiac arrest.

Well quit keeping everyone in suspense and post it.

[Bearhugger]

I have changed my thinking on this a bit and have no issue with JV wrestlers being in regionals or states.

My only stipulation would be that there is no separating them in the brackets from the varsity wrestler. If a team is going to enter a JV wrestler in the tournament then all scoring wrestlers should be at risk of elimination by that JV wrestler, not just scoring wrestlers of other teams. With risk comes reward, but there also should be an actual risk for the team entering their JV wrestler. They should not get the benefit of doubling their chances of having a qualifier/champion without the risk of having their wrestlers face each other.

My guess is most people who support JV wrestlers in regionals/states won't like this idea because they won't like the possibility of their scoring varsity wrestler getting eliminated by the non-scoring JV and hurting their teams chances of placing higher in team scoring.

Teams entering JV wrestlers should not get preferential treatment by being moved to the other side of the bracket to maximize their chances of going higher up the bracket and minimize chances of the varsity wrestler getting eliminated by the JV. If you are going to put him in there then you take the risk just like everyone else.

The seeding criteria used for all wrestlers should be used for ALL wrestlers. If Braxton County has the #1 seed at 285, then the seeding criteria should be used to seed the JV 285 from Braxton County. If the two Braxton County 285s meet in the opening round, then so be it. If they meet in the finals, then so be it. If the varsity 285 from Braxton does NOT qualify, then so be it.

The cream will rise to the top.

[Bearhugger]

Bearhugger, I see you have quoted me but then go in a different direction. I never mentioned hard work or JV. Simply pointing out the way I think WV currently handles individual sports and post season qualifying although I may not be correct. I'm not sure what the ideal solution is.

If I had to pick a system, I'd probably lean toward having a team designate 14 "scoring" wrestlers for postseason regardless of weight but any number of wrestlers from each team could enter and qualify for post-season. Some just would not score for their team. I think the state of Washington or one of the Dakotas does something like this. It's probably not ideal, but is "somewhat" fair to all teams as only a set number score, but obviously teams with greater depth at some weights would benefit.

Also, this might be a good topic for a new thread.

I liked your commentary and decided it would be a good launch pad for what I wanted to add.

[Bearhugger]

Bearhugger -

The point is a good point, but as you peel back the layer of the onion, some more, are all of those kids living in the Independence High School District, or did some transfer out of district that helped create the example that you site? Not saying anyone did anything wrong, immoral, or unethical, each county has policies for transfers, so nothing done illegal and not trying to claim that they did. I am saying that there are wrestlers at all schools that cross district lines to be part of something that they feel is right for them. Indy has a good thing going and those in the surrounding area that can be part of it, do what they can to be part of it.

What is created is a very good wrestler, wrestling JV, because there are more than one good kid there now at each weight class. It is unfortunately the nature of the beast, and rules should not be changed because of flocking, or recruiting would grow, more schools would suffer with less wrestlers available than already do.

WVSSAC allows for the out of district transfer from 8th to 9th grade. It is not wrong to do it, but when it does happen and somebody sits, that is also part of the scenario.

East Fairmont might have the two best 106 pounders in AA/A.

Point Pleasant has a few good kids log jammed in 106 through 120.

Parkersburg South has a returning 4th place winner on the bench. Did he drop from 4th best down to no good in less than a year? Would he place in the state tournament this year? My money says yes.

There is no flocking, recruiting, etc.

As you know, wrestling varsity spots are driven by body weight where all other sports are not.

Its this simple, do we want the best to compete against the best of do we want to protect our varsity wrestlers from some JV kid from another school?

[mike.carman]

Here is an idea. Set a minimum number of varsity matches that need to be wrestled. If a coach wants to enter 2 kids at a weight class then he can but only if both meet the minimum number of varsity matches. The coach needs to declare which is the starter and they will be seeded at the regional tournament. The second gets a pig tail match against a lower seed. whoever wins the pig tail match moves on in the tournament and whoever loses the pig tail match is eliminated.

[Bearhugger]

Here is an idea. Set a minimum number of varsity matches that need to be wrestled. If a coach wants to enter 2 kids at a weight class then he can but only if both meet the minimum number of varsity matches. The coach needs to declare which is the starter and they will be seeded at the regional tournament. The second gets a pig tail match against a lower seed. whoever wins the pig tail match moves on in the tournament and whoever loses the pig tail match is eliminated.

The evolution continues. Great stuff. Watch for the "Last Man Standing" forum topic later today. Everybody should keep the number for 911 handy.

On the other hand, this might cause some to shave off their mullet and scream "LET THEM ALL WRESTLE.....LETS SEE WHO IS THE BEST!!!!!"

[mike.carman]

Here is an idea. Set a minimum number of varsity matches that need to be wrestled. If a coach wants to enter 2 kids at a weight class then he can but only if both meet the minimum number of varsity matches. The coach needs to declare which is the starter and they will be seeded at the regional tournament. The second gets a pig tail match against a lower seed. whoever wins the pig tail match moves on in the tournament and whoever loses the pig tail match is eliminated.

The evolution continues. Great stuff. Watch for the "Last Man Standing" forum topic later today. Everybody should keep the number for 911 handy.

On the other hand, this might cause some to shave off their mullet and scream "LET THEM ALL WRESTLE.....LETS SEE WHO IS THE BEST!!!!!"

I would be okay with the pig tail idea as it lets the better kids compete for their way into the tournament and it gets good kids off the bench and into the lineup from time to time during the season. And the number could be low like 5 or something like that.

But don't mistake my devils advocate approach to being on the side of letting JV's in the tournament. I still don't like it.

[Bearhugger]

Here is an idea. Set a minimum number of varsity matches that need to be wrestled. If a coach wants to enter 2 kids at a weight class then he can but only if both meet the minimum number of varsity matches. The coach needs to declare which is the starter and they will be seeded at the regional tournament. The second gets a pig tail match against a lower seed. whoever wins the pig tail match moves on in the tournament and whoever loses the pig tail match is eliminated.

The evolution continues. Great stuff. Watch for the "Last Man Standing" forum topic later today. Everybody should keep the number for 911 handy.

On the other hand, this might cause some to shave off their mullet and scream "LET THEM ALL WRESTLE.....LETS SEE WHO IS THE BEST!!!!!"

I would be okay with the pig tail idea as it lets the better kids compete for their way into the tournament and it gets good kids off the bench and into the lineup from time to time during the season. And the number could be low like 5 or something like that.

But don't mistake my devils advocate approach to being on the side of letting JV's in the tournament. I still don't like it.

The "Last Man Standing" involves the usage of pigtails.

[greencrush]

Make the pigtail match against the varsity wrestler. There problem solved.
Since they couldn't settle it in wrestle offs.

[mike.carman]

Make the pigtail match against the varsity wrestler. There problem solved.
Since they couldn't settle it in wrestle offs.

That was always my intentions on suggesting pigtails.