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ringworm14 wrote:

Lloyd Christmas wrote:You said "where was the outrage when it was region 4" Im just saying it was NEVER region 4. Thanks

2006 region 4 places 33 at states…meaning the other 51 spots was between three regions…average 17 per region. Not quite rankings…not double. But…close.

You’re welcome.

“Beware of the ringworm!”
— Maui

I’m sorry my team was in aaa back then. I didn’t really pay attention to aa

ringworm14 wrote:

Lloyd Christmas wrote:You said "where was the outrage when it was region 4" Im just saying it was NEVER region 4. Thanks

2006 region 4 places 33 at states…meaning the other 51 spots was between three regions…average 17 per region. Not quite rankings…not double. But…close.

You’re welcome.

“Beware of the ringworm!”
— Maui

You had to go back 18 years ago to 2006 to find a time when Region 4 was even close to as loaded as Region 1 is and has been. That year, Region 1 still had 24 state placers.

List of AA-A ranked wrestlers who did not qualify for states out of their respective regions: (from the latest ranking, and only counting ranked wrestlers who actually wrestled, not those who scratched)

https://www.wvmat.com/polls/2402092a.htm

Region One (Previous State Placement in Parenthesis)
106 #4 Wes Files (Frankfort)
126 #5 Owen Rotruck (Keyser)
126 #8 Wyatt Wolanski (Oak Glen) (4th@120 in '23)
132 #4 Delbert Van Tassel (Cameron)
138 #4 Caden Michalski (Fairmont Sr) (6th@120 in '22)
138 #8 Alex Smith (Frankfort) (5th@126 in '23)
165 #6 LJ Diaz (East Fairmont)
165 #10 Daniel Shoemaker (Keyser)
190 #10 Krystian Norris (Berkeley Springs)

Region Two
138 #10 Landon Bush (Lewis County)

Region Three
None

Region Four
215 #9 Chaz Burns (Wirt County)

Lloyd Christmas wrote:You said "where was the outrage when it was region 4" Im just saying it was NEVER region 4. Thanks

Well I we are going off polls. That seems to work well for the government during elections. When I was in school guess we didn’t complain our parents didn’t go on forums and wine. We knew we needed to get better. Bottom line to this whole thing. Y
You want to go to states place top four.

As recent as 2022, I believe Region 4 AA/A put 8 of the 14 wrestlers at the top of the podium at States. I believe they also had the most ranked wrestlers in the tournament, as well.

aacoach108 wrote:List of AA-A ranked wrestlers who did not qualify for states out of their respective regions: (from the latest ranking, and only counting ranked wrestlers who actually wrestled, not those who scratched)

https://www.wvmat.com/polls/2402092a.htm

Region One (Previous State Placement in Parenthesis)
106 #4 Wes Files (Frankfort)
126 #5 Owen Rotruck (Keyser)
126 #8 Wyatt Wolanski (Oak Glen) (4th@120 in '23)
132 #4 Delbert Van Tassel (Cameron)
138 #4 Caden Michalski (Fairmont Sr) (6th@120 in '22)
138 #8 Alex Smith (Frankfort) (5th@126 in '23)
165 #6 LJ Diaz (East Fairmont)
165 #10 Daniel Shoemaker (Keyser)
190 #10 Krystian Norris (Berkeley Springs)

Region Two
138 #10 Landon Bush (Lewis County)

Region Three
None

Region Four
215 #9 Chaz Burns (Wirt County)

I hate to see so many good wrestlers not qualify for states… regardless….

aacoach108 wrote:List of AA-A ranked wrestlers who did not qualify for states out of their respective regions: (from the latest ranking, and only counting ranked wrestlers who actually wrestled, not those who scratched)

https://www.wvmat.com/polls/2402092a.htm

Region One (Previous State Placement in Parenthesis)
106 #4 Wes Files (Frankfort)
126 #5 Owen Rotruck (Keyser)
126 #8 Wyatt Wolanski (Oak Glen) (4th@120 in '23)
132 #4 Delbert Van Tassel (Cameron)
138 #4 Caden Michalski (Fairmont Sr) (6th@120 in '22)
138 #8 Alex Smith (Frankfort) (5th@126 in '23)
165 #6 LJ Diaz (East Fairmont)
165 #10 Daniel Shoemaker (Keyser)
190 #10 Krystian Norris (Berkeley Springs)

What you have actually done here is proven that rankings are not a definitive judge of who the top wrestlers in a weight class are. Three of the wrestlers you listed are ranked top 4 in the state, yet they were unable to finish top 4 in their region. Conceptually, a wrestler that is ranked top 10 in the state should be able to finish at least top 4 in his/her region (with exception of weights with 5 or more ranked wrestlers). Two of those #4 ranked wrestlers lost to a lower ranked wrestler and an unranked wrestler at regionals which makes me wonder why they were ranked top 4 in the state.

Every year ranked wrestlers are not on the podium and unranked wrestlers are. That is because the rankings are for entertainment purposes and are not absolute.

aacoach117 wrote:

aacoach108 wrote:List of AA-A ranked wrestlers who did not qualify for states out of their respective regions: (from the latest ranking, and only counting ranked wrestlers who actually wrestled, not those who scratched)

https://www.wvmat.com/polls/2402092a.htm

Region One (Previous State Placement in Parenthesis)
106 #4 Wes Files (Frankfort)
126 #5 Owen Rotruck (Keyser)
126 #8 Wyatt Wolanski (Oak Glen) (4th@120 in '23)
132 #4 Delbert Van Tassel (Cameron)
138 #4 Caden Michalski (Fairmont Sr) (6th@120 in '22)
138 #8 Alex Smith (Frankfort) (5th@126 in '23)
165 #6 LJ Diaz (East Fairmont)
165 #10 Daniel Shoemaker (Keyser)
190 #10 Krystian Norris (Berkeley Springs)

What you have actually done here is proven that rankings are not a definitive judge of who the top wrestlers in a weight class are. Three of the wrestlers you listed are ranked top 4 in the state, yet they were unable to finish top 4 in their region. Conceptually, a wrestler that is ranked top 10 in the state should be able to finish at least top 4 in his/her region (with exception of weights with 5 or more ranked wrestlers). Two of those #4 ranked wrestlers lost to a lower ranked wrestler and an unranked wrestler at regionals which makes me wonder why they were ranked top 4 in the state.

Every year ranked wrestlers are not on the podium and unranked wrestlers are. That is because the rankings are for entertainment purposes and are not absolute.

aacoach117, the nail you hit on the head is "which makes me wonder why they were ranked top 4 in the state".

No wrestler competing in Huntington next week was likely born yet in 2006 lol.

I attended AA/A Region 1 on Saturday.

1. I was probably the only person in attendance that was not affiliated with any of the participating schools.

2. The level of competition surpassed any event I attended this past season. The only exception might be the WSAZ but it is very close.

More to come.

Bearhugger wrote:I attended AA/A Region 1 on Saturday.

1. I was probably the only person in attendance that was not affiliated with any of the participating schools.

2. The level of competition surpassed any event I attended this past season. The only exception might be the WSAZ but it is very close.

More to come.

Not saying it wasn't good competition, but you would need to list what else you attended that you are comparing it to.

ringworm14 wrote:

RegionOne_fan wrote:I'm not exactly new to wrestling, but how long ago was it the region 4 had twice as many ranked kids as any other to regions combined?

I don’t know about rankings, but region four placed more kids in Huntington and had more champs for a long stretch mid 2000s to mid 2010s I’d say. That’s when the Roane county boys were dominant, Calhoun was loaded, and I believe Point Pleasant has its first run. Recent enough I remember how good they were. I think region four finished 1-2-3 in a few consecutive years too but might be wrong in that. Only thing that changed that region was reclassification pushed teams up and down so they had to redo the regions to even it up. Nothing to do with the talent. The ups go down and downs go up!

“Beware of the ringworm!”
— Common Sense

This is entirely false. Please show proof of this claim. Oak Glen won states every year from 97-09 and most of the top wrestlers in the state were always from Region 1. Unless you're referring to AAA, this statement is completely false. You can look at the list of state placers from those years to see how dominant Region 1 has always been since the origin of West Virginia wrestling.

aacoach117 wrote:

aacoach108 wrote:List of AA-A ranked wrestlers who did not qualify for states out of their respective regions: (from the latest ranking, and only counting ranked wrestlers who actually wrestled, not those who scratched)

https://www.wvmat.com/polls/2402092a.htm

Region One (Previous State Placement in Parenthesis)
106 #4 Wes Files (Frankfort)
126 #5 Owen Rotruck (Keyser)
126 #8 Wyatt Wolanski (Oak Glen) (4th@120 in '23)
132 #4 Delbert Van Tassel (Cameron)
138 #4 Caden Michalski (Fairmont Sr) (6th@120 in '22)
138 #8 Alex Smith (Frankfort) (5th@126 in '23)
165 #6 LJ Diaz (East Fairmont)
165 #10 Daniel Shoemaker (Keyser)
190 #10 Krystian Norris (Berkeley Springs)

What you have actually done here is proven that rankings are not a definitive judge of who the top wrestlers in a weight class are. Three of the wrestlers you listed are ranked top 4 in the state, yet they were unable to finish top 4 in their region. Conceptually, a wrestler that is ranked top 10 in the state should be able to finish at least top 4 in his/her region (with exception of weights with 5 or more ranked wrestlers). Two of those #4 ranked wrestlers lost to a lower ranked wrestler and an unranked wrestler at regionals which makes me wonder why they were ranked top 4 in the state.

Every year ranked wrestlers are not on the podium and unranked wrestlers are. That is because the rankings are for entertainment purposes and are not absolute.

This is absurd on its face. All this proves is the depth of Region 1. All of these kids would have went to states if they were in any other region in the state. I honestly don't know how anyone could draw some other conclusion from these results. I guess confirmation bias is real.

Weir_Coach wrote:

ringworm14 wrote:

RegionOne_fan wrote:I'm not exactly new to wrestling, but how long ago was it the region 4 had twice as many ranked kids as any other to regions combined?

I don’t know about rankings, but region four placed more kids in Huntington and had more champs for a long stretch mid 2000s to mid 2010s I’d say. That’s when the Roane county boys were dominant, Calhoun was loaded, and I believe Point Pleasant has its first run. Recent enough I remember how good they were. I think region four finished 1-2-3 in a few consecutive years too but might be wrong in that. Only thing that changed that region was reclassification pushed teams up and down so they had to redo the regions to even it up. Nothing to do with the talent. The ups go down and downs go up!

“Beware of the ringworm!”
— Common Sense

This is entirely false. Please show proof of this claim. Oak Glen won states every year from 97-09 and most of the top wrestlers in the state were always from Region 1. Unless you're referring to AAA, this statement is completely false. You can look at the list of state placers from those years to see how dominant Region 1 has always been since the origin of West Virginia wrestling.

Jed, I mean Ringworm, doesn't believe in facts

I am confused by all this. Everyone should be rejoicing that Region 1 is so good. The conversation should be centered around on how to make Regions 2,3,&4 better. Bringing the bottom up toward the top is far better than pushing the top back down toward the bottom.

Altering the qualification process for the state tournament is not the answer. How much money do people really want to throw at having another tournament costing schools transportation, hotels, and meals not to mention the parents having to take off work and travel. It is clear that the regions with the best wrestlers have more and better access to club wrestling year-round. I believe having good wrestlers miss out on the state tournament is a good thing, that means competition is improving.

One last thought; A 5th place finisher in their respective region is not real likely to finish in the Top 6 competing against the entire state, no matter what their ranking was throughout the year. My advice is that these wrestlers who are on the bubble of making it out of their region would be to freely transfer to another region. Take advantage of the laws your state legislature has granted you.

Weir Coach is spot on yet again.

For sake of discussion on the aspect of Polls not being an accurate ranking as far as who good kids in Region 1 is just not true. The coaches polls are generally as accurate as the information a particular coach has available. Either the coach saw a kid wrestle and was impressed, they see results posted and see a kid win against other good quality wrestlers they know, or they go off name recognition. Granted some coaches don't take part in these polls, and maybe some just vote for their own kids.

Lets talk about Bear Tracker's ranking though. Set criteria for those. You have a pre-season rank based on last years outcome. Then to move up the kid has to beat someone ranked above them. Pretty clear the value of that system is that it is results based not opinion based. The results based ranking shows exactly what Weir Coach started this thread about.

The truth is that region 1 is across the board loaded. Region 1 tournament is one of the toughest tournaments in WV period hands down.

Jon Perkins wrote:One last thought; A 5th place finisher in their respective region is not real likely to finish in the Top 6 competing against the entire state, no matter what their ranking was throughout the year.

Well, you'd be wrong. There were several wrestlers who did not qualify out of region 1 who would've placed top 4 or even won other regions in the state. There were also state placers from the previous year who didn't qualify for states this year due to stacked weight classes in Region 1, something other regions will never and have never had to worry about ever in WV A/AA history.

Weir_Coach wrote:

Jon Perkins wrote:One last thought; A 5th place finisher in their respective region is not real likely to finish in the Top 6 competing against the entire state, no matter what their ranking was throughout the year.

Past example: 2018 Region 1 AA/A, Weir's 285 Jordan Brueck finished 5th in the region, did not qualify for states. A wrestler was then unable to compete at states, Brueck got in last-minute and placed 5th in the state

I am sure there are plenty of examples that dispute my opinion, I will not argue that, but there are plenty of examples that support it. The point was that it is not a viable option to revise the qualification process for the entire state, just to benefit one or two people fighting for a 5th place trophy.

Jon Perkins wrote:I am sure there are plenty of examples that dispute my opinion, I will not argue that, but there are plenty of examples that support it. The point was that it is not a viable option to revise the qualification process for the entire state, just to benefit one or two people fighting for a 5th place trophy.

What are some examples that support your claim??

Lloyd Christmas wrote:

Jon Perkins wrote:I am sure there are plenty of examples that dispute my opinion, I will not argue that, but there are plenty of examples that support it. The point was that it is not a viable option to revise the qualification process for the entire state, just to benefit one or two people fighting for a 5th place trophy.

What are some examples that support your claim??

The examples that support my claims is as follows:

The most competitive matches in the Regional Tournament should be the Consolation Semifinals, because it is either do or die. If you win you qualify for the state tournament and if you lose you get to sit and watch. In each region there are 28 of these matches and this year in Region One there were 21 pins. I am sorry but these are not competitive matches and those getting pinned cannot and will not compete for a spot on the podium at the state tournament.

Jon Perkins wrote:

Lloyd Christmas wrote:

Jon Perkins wrote:I am sure there are plenty of examples that dispute my opinion, I will not argue that, but there are plenty of examples that support it. The point was that it is not a viable option to revise the qualification process for the entire state, just to benefit one or two people fighting for a 5th place trophy.

What are some examples that support your claim??

The examples that support my claims is as follows:

The most competitive matches in the Regional Tournament should be the Consolation Semifinals, because it is either do or die. If you win you qualify for the state tournament and if you lose you get to sit and watch. In each region there are 28 of these matches and this year in Region One there were 21 pins. I am sorry but these are not competitive matches and those getting pinned cannot and will not compete for a spot on the podium at the state tournament.

That's a rather poor example

Jon Perkins wrote:

Lloyd Christmas wrote:

Jon Perkins wrote:I am sure there are plenty of examples that dispute my opinion, I will not argue that, but there are plenty of examples that support it. The point was that it is not a viable option to revise the qualification process for the entire state, just to benefit one or two people fighting for a 5th place trophy.

What are some examples that support your claim??

The examples that support my claims is as follows:

The most competitive matches in the Regional Tournament should be the Consolation Semifinals, because it is either do or die. If you win you qualify for the state tournament and if you lose you get to sit and watch. In each region there are 28 of these matches and this year in Region One there were 21 pins. I am sorry but these are not competitive matches and those getting pinned cannot and will not compete for a spot on the podium at the state tournament.

I don't have a dog in this fight but that is flawed logic.

National Example. Myles Martin beats Bo Nickal 11-9 at Big 10. 2 weeks later Nickal pins Martin in the finals of NCAA
Is Martin not competitive?

recent pointed state level example. 126# OG vs BS in the consi semis. Place winner from last year gets pinned. then loses a fairly close match in the 5th place match. The kid who actually got 5th has past wins over the 4th place who has past win over the kid who finished 3rd. we see Fall in the results but have no idea what was happening before that or how competitive the match was at the time. sounds to me like 3-6 could all be competitive for a spot wrestling on saturday.

Very similar situation at 138

You are saying these kids with past places at state wouldn't be able to compete for a spot on the podium?

I know we say a pin the the penultimate way to win a match. it awards the most points in team scoring and shows dominance but if we are only looking at the results without seeing the match and saying they wouldn't be in the running that is where i see a flaw.

I have seen kids wrestle 6 times in a season and kid A wins 5 times and the one loss is a fall. while the rest of the results are major decisions for Wrestler A.

I am interested to see how these regions play out next year. if it doesnt change i really hope there is a situation next year that would allow me to sneak up to wherever that A/AA R1 tournament is held.

Jon Perkins wrote:I am confused by all this. Everyone should be rejoicing that Region 1 is so good. The conversation should be centered around on how to make Regions 2,3,&4 better. Bringing the bottom up toward the top is far better than pushing the top back down toward the bottom.

Altering the qualification process for the state tournament is not the answer. How much money do people really want to throw at having another tournament costing schools transportation, hotels, and meals not to mention the parents having to take off work and travel. It is clear that the regions with the best wrestlers have more and better access to club wrestling year-round. I believe having good wrestlers miss out on the state tournament is a good thing, that means competition is improving.

One last thought; A 5th place finisher in their respective region is not real likely to finish in the Top 6 competing against the entire state, no matter what their ranking was throughout the year. My advice is that these wrestlers who are on the bubble of making it out of their region would be to freely transfer to another region. Take advantage of the laws your state legislature has granted you.

Not looking for controversy, but want to point out a fact about your last comment and I believe there are several instances where a 5th place finisher in Region 1 has been on the podium at the State Tournament over the years. I am sure someone in another Region also has placed 5th in their respective Region and been on the podium the following week, I can only speak for Region 1 A/AA.

More particularly, 2009, a kid from Oak Glen placed 5th at the Regional wrestling tournament, and was in the Finals at the State Tournament then next week. Not only did this kid place as runner up at the 189 pound division, but I am pretty sure that without him in the tournament, Point Pleasant would had won the Team title, thus ending the Oak Glen run. The Oak Glen wrestler beat a Point Pleasant wrestler in the quarters and by the Oak Glen kid placing 2nd and the victory over the Point kid, those points were the difference maker for Oak Glens State Championship!

aacoach107 wrote:

Jon Perkins wrote:I am confused by all this. Everyone should be rejoicing that Region 1 is so good. The conversation should be centered around on how to make Regions 2,3,&4 better. Bringing the bottom up toward the top is far better than pushing the top back down toward the bottom.

Altering the qualification process for the state tournament is not the answer. How much money do people really want to throw at having another tournament costing schools transportation, hotels, and meals not to mention the parents having to take off work and travel. It is clear that the regions with the best wrestlers have more and better access to club wrestling year-round. I believe having good wrestlers miss out on the state tournament is a good thing, that means competition is improving.

One last thought; A 5th place finisher in their respective region is not real likely to finish in the Top 6 competing against the entire state, no matter what their ranking was throughout the year. My advice is that these wrestlers who are on the bubble of making it out of their region would be to freely transfer to another region. Take advantage of the laws your state legislature has granted you.

Not looking for controversy, but want to point out a fact about your last comment and I believe there are several instances where a 5th place finisher in Region 1 has been on the podium at the State Tournament over the years. I am sure someone in another Region also has placed 5th in their respective Region and been on the podium the following week, I can only speak for Region 1 A/AA.

More particularly, 2009, a kid from Oak Glen placed 5th at the Regional wrestling tournament, and was in the Finals at the State Tournament then next week. Not only did this kid place as runner up at the 189 pound division, but I am pretty sure that without him in the tournament, Point Pleasant would had won the Team title, thus ending the Oak Glen run. The Oak Glen wrestler beat a Point Pleasant wrestler in the quarters and by the Oak Glen kid placing 2nd and the victory over the Point kid, those points were the difference maker for Oak Glens State Championship!

Montero was his name. Highly respected kid from Oak Glen, alot of coaches felt he was a top 2 kid in state heading in to regionals, was the two seed I believe in that region, and he got thrown and stuck twice. Remember that vividly. Radabaugh, Williamstown wrestler (regional champ), did some training on Sunday and broke his leg, if I'm not mistaken. Montero scored 18 points and Oak Glen won by 20. Very feasible that was the deciding factor.

mscoach20 wrote:

aacoach107 wrote:

Jon Perkins wrote:I am confused by all this. Everyone should be rejoicing that Region 1 is so good. The conversation should be centered around on how to make Regions 2,3,&4 better. Bringing the bottom up toward the top is far better than pushing the top back down toward the bottom.

Altering the qualification process for the state tournament is not the answer. How much money do people really want to throw at having another tournament costing schools transportation, hotels, and meals not to mention the parents having to take off work and travel. It is clear that the regions with the best wrestlers have more and better access to club wrestling year-round. I believe having good wrestlers miss out on the state tournament is a good thing, that means competition is improving.

One last thought; A 5th place finisher in their respective region is not real likely to finish in the Top 6 competing against the entire state, no matter what their ranking was throughout the year. My advice is that these wrestlers who are on the bubble of making it out of their region would be to freely transfer to another region. Take advantage of the laws your state legislature has granted you.

Not looking for controversy, but want to point out a fact about your last comment and I believe there are several instances where a 5th place finisher in Region 1 has been on the podium at the State Tournament over the years. I am sure someone in another Region also has placed 5th in their respective Region and been on the podium the following week, I can only speak for Region 1 A/AA.

More particularly, 2009, a kid from Oak Glen placed 5th at the Regional wrestling tournament, and was in the Finals at the State Tournament then next week. Not only did this kid place as runner up at the 189 pound division, but I am pretty sure that without him in the tournament, Point Pleasant would had won the Team title, thus ending the Oak Glen run. The Oak Glen wrestler beat a Point Pleasant wrestler in the quarters and by the Oak Glen kid placing 2nd and the victory over the Point kid, those points were the difference maker for Oak Glens State Championship!

Montero was his name. Highly respected kid from Oak Glen, alot of coaches felt he was a top 2 kid in state heading in to regionals, was the two seed I believe in that region, and he got thrown and stuck twice. Remember that vividly. Radabaugh, Williamstown wrestler (regional champ), did some training on Sunday and broke his leg, if I'm not mistaken. Montero scored 18 points and Oak Glen won by 20. Very feasible that was the deciding factor.

Yep, Zac Montero of Oak Glen got 2nd in 2009 after placing 5th at Region 1. That was the last of the 13 consecutive championships Oak Glen won. If not for him qualifying, the record would be 12.

mscoach20 wrote:

aacoach107 wrote:

Jon Perkins wrote:I am confused by all this. Everyone should be rejoicing that Region 1 is so good. The conversation should be centered around on how to make Regions 2,3,&4 better. Bringing the bottom up toward the top is far better than pushing the top back down toward the bottom.

Altering the qualification process for the state tournament is not the answer. How much money do people really want to throw at having another tournament costing schools transportation, hotels, and meals not to mention the parents having to take off work and travel. It is clear that the regions with the best wrestlers have more and better access to club wrestling year-round. I believe having good wrestlers miss out on the state tournament is a good thing, that means competition is improving.

One last thought; A 5th place finisher in their respective region is not real likely to finish in the Top 6 competing against the entire state, no matter what their ranking was throughout the year. My advice is that these wrestlers who are on the bubble of making it out of their region would be to freely transfer to another region. Take advantage of the laws your state legislature has granted you.

Not looking for controversy, but want to point out a fact about your last comment and I believe there are several instances where a 5th place finisher in Region 1 has been on the podium at the State Tournament over the years. I am sure someone in another Region also has placed 5th in their respective Region and been on the podium the following week, I can only speak for Region 1 A/AA.

More particularly, 2009, a kid from Oak Glen placed 5th at the Regional wrestling tournament, and was in the Finals at the State Tournament then next week. Not only did this kid place as runner up at the 189 pound division, but I am pretty sure that without him in the tournament, Point Pleasant would had won the Team title, thus ending the Oak Glen run. The Oak Glen wrestler beat a Point Pleasant wrestler in the quarters and by the Oak Glen kid placing 2nd and the victory over the Point kid, those points were the difference maker for Oak Glens State Championship!

Montero was his name. Highly respected kid from Oak Glen, alot of coaches felt he was a top 2 kid in state heading in to regionals, was the two seed I believe in that region, and he got thrown and stuck twice. Remember that vividly. Radabaugh, Williamstown wrestler (regional champ), did some training on Sunday and broke his leg, if I'm not mistaken. Montero scored 18 points and Oak Glen won by 20. Very feasible that was the deciding factor.

I was on that team and buddies with Radabaugh. He broke his leg the night of regionals after slipping on ice on an inclined driveway. Most people were running from Gallaher from Grafton in that weight anyways. Good memory you have there!

Jon Perkins wrote:

Lloyd Christmas wrote:

Jon Perkins wrote:I am sure there are plenty of examples that dispute my opinion, I will not argue that, but there are plenty of examples that support it. The point was that it is not a viable option to revise the qualification process for the entire state, just to benefit one or two people fighting for a 5th place trophy.

What are some examples that support your claim??

The examples that support my claims is as follows:

The most competitive matches in the Regional Tournament should be the Consolation Semifinals, because it is either do or die. If you win you qualify for the state tournament and if you lose you get to sit and watch. In each region there are 28 of these matches and this year in Region One there were 21 pins. I am sorry but these are not competitive matches and those getting pinned cannot and will not compete for a spot on the podium at the state tournament.

Where are your examples again?? I may have missed them

HiCoach wrote:

mscoach20 wrote:

aacoach107 wrote:
Not looking for controversy, but want to point out a fact about your last comment and I believe there are several instances where a 5th place finisher in Region 1 has been on the podium at the State Tournament over the years. I am sure someone in another Region also has placed 5th in their respective Region and been on the podium the following week, I can only speak for Region 1 A/AA.

More particularly, 2009, a kid from Oak Glen placed 5th at the Regional wrestling tournament, and was in the Finals at the State Tournament then next week. Not only did this kid place as runner up at the 189 pound division, but I am pretty sure that without him in the tournament, Point Pleasant would had won the Team title, thus ending the Oak Glen run. The Oak Glen wrestler beat a Point Pleasant wrestler in the quarters and by the Oak Glen kid placing 2nd and the victory over the Point kid, those points were the difference maker for Oak Glens State Championship!

Montero was his name. Highly respected kid from Oak Glen, alot of coaches felt he was a top 2 kid in state heading in to regionals, was the two seed I believe in that region, and he got thrown and stuck twice. Remember that vividly. Radabaugh, Williamstown wrestler (regional champ), did some training on Sunday and broke his leg, if I'm not mistaken. Montero scored 18 points and Oak Glen won by 20. Very feasible that was the deciding factor.

I was on that team and buddies with Radabaugh. He broke his leg the night of regionals after slipping on ice on an inclined driveway. Most people were running from Gallaher from Grafton in that weight anyways. Good memory you have there!

Thank you for clarifying how it happened! What a wild way to end a season. He likely was state finalist that year, as well. Very good wrestler.

As to they wouldn't have won without him, we are not sure. Won by 20. He scored 18. Possibly they win by 2 points. Maybe they lose. Regardless, it was a wild series of events!